4wd ;)

[speedaddict]

Ok, so i'm kinda going another way with my build.

I want 4wd and bunch of ground clearance.

PLAN A:The axles will be 1-ton. Dana 60 front with 14-bolt rear. They're dime a dozen around here. I'm thinkin about T-5 tranny with independent transfer case. Driveshafts will def be custom along with crossmembers.

PLAN B:Is to run an 8.8expo and a jeep frontend.

Suspension will just be leaf springs right now, along with crossover steering. Maybe later on swicth to coilovers. Plan on at least 42" tires.

Anybody have any other input or ideas/suggestions? Heres a pic of what i'm shootin for, except single cab;)

[speedaddict]

So I'm really seroius about this.

I didnt think many ppl on here knew much about 4wd. Just thought since i am gonna do it see what ya'll thought about the first turbo 4wd ranger.

We already know there's a bronco2 hahahahaha

[smashed96gt]

I don't think it would be the first 4wd 2.3T.

And with 42's and those axles you're going to need a lot of power down low. Not exactly where the 2.3 makes it's power.

[speedaddict]

The first 2.5T 4wd Ranger.

Only other 2.5T 4wd is jess's bro's jeep.

I figure low gears, and it should pull pretty good. Turbo's pretty big and it spools around 3500rpms. Some headwork and pulse paired a header should spool quicker. makein up for that loss of power down low.
I've turned bigger with less motor and just gears. Gears are pretty much what i'm relieing on.

[fordnut71]

y not a explorer 8.8 with a dana 44 from a full size bronco? would still hold good power from a well built small block.

t5 tranny?? has a hard time holding power from a stock small block.

[speedaddict]

Expo 8.8 in the rear would be fine.

D-44 up front from full size has coil springs. I'd have to grind on the axle and weld perches for leaves or find a way to make a radius arm work to keep axle centered. Also if im not mistaking its a couple inches wider than the 8.8. I either want both fullsize, or both midsize. Ya know :lol:

What other suggestions do you have for tranny? Use the m5od? The one i got now needs rebuilding.

[FordRacingZX3]

I've been wanting to try a 4x4 as well, but instead of crazy lift just give it a wide stance kinda like this, but not as insane

http://image.fourwheeler.com/f/17914932/129_0904_15_z+2008_sema_show+ford_ranger_4x4.jpg

probably a total of 6" wider front and rear stock ride height. Independent front and rear suspension. Probably do most of the widening with a heavy offset wheel. Not wanting to build for offroading, but rather a rally car on a truck chassis. So possibly lowering as well.

I've got a T-bird Turbo Coupe sitting around so I could also just try a 4 link rear with solid 8.8 axle.

But honestly, for that size of tire. I'd personally build it as a auto unless your gonna put a small/big block into it. Might help wear and tear and help boosting sooner.

[jfive]

There are all sorts of dana 44 fronts out there and I have to say ford 9 inch rear and 44 up front. Also you could take an extended cab 4X4 ranger and put it on a older F150 shortbox frame. I have a friend that took a S10 blazer and put the cab on a half ton pick up that was all jacked up. Looked real good after some fabrication, and only had to cut like a foot off the frame. P.S. that ranger looks awesome.

[Totally Confused]

I would set the turbo up to spool ALOT sooner than 3500 rpm. That kind of windup isn't going to be good on the street, even with deep gears. I would also find a tranny that was married with the xcase, since you are building a reg. cab truck. I am also building a Ranger Supercab for 4wheeling, and even with the Supercab, the drivetrain is stupid long with a divorce mount xcase and manual tranny. I am looking at running 4.10 to 4.56 gears, even with a bulldog 4 speed and a 331 V8 with 36" rubber, so a 4 banger, turbo or not, is going to need some serious gears to turn those tires, let alone anything bigger. If you are serious about the turbo hitting at about 3500 rpm's, be ready to have to slip the clutch alot just to get going.

As for axles, isn't your truck an "A" arm setup? If so, then coilovers would be the easiest for you to convert the front, I would think, since you won't have to do near as much fab work, just radius arm mounts, trackbar, and improve the factory mounts on the frame to better support coilovers. If you could find one, a D44 from an Early Bronco would be about the right width, along with the 9"rear. As for the Jeep front end, that is what I have under my V8 Ranger, but from a Cherokee, along with a D44 rear from the Cherokee.

[D94R]

If you're going to go solid axle, I'd suggest going something bigger than a Dana 30 from a Jeep Cherokee (theres a reason its one of the first things we swap out when going with bigger tires or more power). Since you already have a Plan A of a D60, shoot for that.

Anything bigger than a 33 with lockers up front is asking for ring gear defilement. 42's??? LOL, on a D30? Good luck.

D30 = weak ujoints, weak hubs, weak axle shafts, weak ring gear/pinion gear, weak axle tubes. If you're serious about building a 4x4 Ranger then the D30 isn't a good choice. I'm surprised that TotallyConfused's V8 Ranger hasn't killed the D30. If you plan on just using this for wooded trails and fishing trips it will suffice, but anything serious like mud pits and rock climbing you'll soon put an end to its life.




The D44 rear is a good choice, but again 42's will be past its limit for serious hardcore wheeling. You're really looking for 1-ton axles with tires that big, and even then you're starting to push the limits of D60's unless you build the shat out of them. The 8.8 is mucho stronger than the D44, and could hold its own against the D60 in the rear, for a while, depending on setup and off roading.



Anybody have any other input or ideas/suggestions?
Join Pirate4x4 and find out how to really build a proper setup.







Unless you're building this for looks and mud puddles.

[Totally Confused]

What I was responding to was his "plan B" Okay. I will agree that the 42s' are too much for the D30, but as far as V8 power killing it, nope, not yet. Also if it is so weak, how does it stand up to FACTORY V8 power in the Grand Cherokees? As for bogging and rocks, IF you actually know how to drive and (most importantly) remember what you are driving it does hold quite well. My Ranger outweighs a Jeep by a long shot, and the only issue that it has ever given me as far as the D30 goes, is bending the long side tube after the front end slid down off of a rock from about 8' high. Yeah, I asked for that kind of damage. Se Lavie. I chose the D30 for availabilty, commoness of parts, and because I know the weak points of them, having wheeled them for over 10 years. Each to their own. He thought of the Jeep frontend, and I simply shared a little info on it. For the BIG tires, yes, I would not go with the small axles, but I ALSO would not go with a small motor that would have to work harder than a larger motor to turn the axles the same amount.
As for the D44/8.8" thing, here we go.... you bring your facts, and I bring mine. I suggested it as an alternative to the (often) overpriced "X" 8.8" that while it does fit nicely in the Ranger ( duh, FACTORY offering ) the Jeep D44 came with 30 spline axles for ALL of the relevant years, 10 1/2 x 3 brakes, and ( my favorite reason for NOT liking the 8.8 ) NO clip, and no tendency to spin the axletube in the housing, not being known for leaky pinion seal, crappy bearing designs, and ALOT cheaper to lock up. Yes, the D44 has weak points, but so does any other axle.

[Totally Confused]

I "do" agree with checking Pirate, deffinately ALOT of good info, but if you sign on, you better be wearing some Nomex underwear around those flame happy fools.

[D94R]

The factory Grand Cherokees with V8's were way underpowered. Those engines aren't worth anything but the scrap value they produce. I also didn't say power was the sole killer of the D30. So a stock GC V8, with stock tires or even slightly larger ones aren't going to kill it.

I have the D30 with 33's and ARB up front. I wheel it in Moab. Its living just fine, though I'm pushing its limits. I think I got the "know how to drive" part covered, thanks. Where do you wheel around?

My Cherokee weighs just shy of 6,000 lbs... your Ranger beats that by a long shot huh?


My "facts" about the 8.8. Warn did a break test on the D44 vs the 8.8 and the 8.8 put the D44 to shame. The D44 axle shafts broke around 4400 or 4600 lb/ft of torque. The 8.8? No one knows, it peaked the machine at 6200 lb/ft of torque and the shafts still held.

You're right though, don't do the C-clip 8.8, because they break all the time :rolleyes5

Here, read what the fools on Pirate have to say about the axles.
Foolish gibberish (http://www.pirate4x4.com/forum/showthread.php?t=24854)

As well, I can pick up complete 8.8's for $120 all day long. The 96+ Explorer axles are 31 spline with disk brakes (infinitely a better option when wheeling in mud/dirt/water), and if you can't find one of these in the JY, you're doing it wrong.

You're right though, when over stressed from poor setup and too large tires the 8.8 can spin its axle tubes (simple fix). That's the territory where the D44 would have already suffered the same fate, and entering total D44 destruction zone.

Leaky pinion seal? Really, hello McFly, they can be replaced, easily. And you're right, big bearing axles are horrid designs :out:

Cheaper to lock up you say? Have you priced Aussie lockers, ARB's, Detroits, Lock rights etc? I have a dealer out of washington I get all my parts from, and there is no price difference between the two axles for any of those lockers. Thanks for playing though.





But my post was to the OP, I only mentioned you in passing with a question as to how you wheel because that does make a difference.

Defend your D30 choice all you want, I don't give a hoot, I wasn't bashing or calling you out. It's a poor choice for his plans though, and thats why he's posting and asking for advice.

[speedaddict]

I am already a member of pirate<--they're funny over there lol. This isn't going to be a hardcore trail rig. But rather a weekend warriar/show truck. It will see a lil mud puddle on occasion but not on a regular basis.

I really want a manual trans. And your very much so right, using a divorced xcase will mean ridiculously long driveshafts.

Leaf springs are such a simple setup. All i need to do is center the axle, weld hangers and a spot for shackles.(i've done it b4 :lol:)

My toyota was running stock axles with 42's. Had 5.29 gears and lockers front/rear. Turned them rather easily. I think i'm gonna go ahead and go big now so i wont have the need to later on.

Now as far as tire size selection goes, I might not go with a 42" tire right off. A 36-38" swamper will suffice my big rubber needs for the time being. I do agree the D30 will not hold up to my huge tire goals. the 8.8expo however would do the job fine, maybe with a lil upgrades in certain spots. The corp14bolt will however turn all day long with no probs as well as the D60 front.

One-ton running gear on a truck that weighs as much as my big toe should be pretty nasty. I feel the motor wont have any problem turning the tires. I have as much power as a mildly built small-block with out the weight.

Keep the suggestions rolling in guys. Bunch of great ideas. BTW here is a photo of my truck lifted on 33's 2wd. My 7.5 held great with 33's and the 2.5 bouncing off the rev limiter daily :hehe:

[D94R]

Now as far as tire size selection goes, I might not go with a 42" tire right off. A 36-38" swamper will suffice my big rubber needs for the time being. I do agree the D30 will not hold up to my huge tire goals. the 8.8expo however would do the job fine, maybe with a lil upgrades in certain spots. The corp14bolt will however turn all day long with no probs as well as the D60 front.

One-ton running gear on a truck that weighs as much as my big toe should be pretty nasty. I feel the motor wont have any problem turning the tires. I have as much power as a mildly built small-block with out the weight.



Yup, the tons, with what you plan the truck for, would be the right choice.

Also, realize that while you make the same power as a mildly built small block you're not making that power in the same place as the small or big blocks, and that's down low in the RPM range.

Low end torque, even with low ass gearing, is what you need to get them big meats a rolling. Now of course the 4 cylinder will move them, but not optimally. With a manual tranny without the low end torque you're gonna be putting more stress on the clutch more likely than anything... in 2wd anyhow. If you run a doubler, or stack transfer case though you can gear that low enough that you could climb Mt Rushmore with a lawn mower engine :hehe:

[speedaddict]

:lol: 5hp briggs and stratton

Thats why i was thinking of getting a quick spooling turbo. Help get them tires rolling. Any suggestions? Maybe .48/.60 garrett would do the trick?

I really like my 1-ton idea. I could go overkill with some duece an half rockwells. Stock with 6.72 gears i believe and pinion brakes.:hehe:

[smashed96gt]

If you're serious about the Rockwells check 100dollarman on Pirate. He sells them 100 for a rear and 900 for a front.

[jfive]

If you want to use a lighter duty rear or frontend you can get moser axles or stuff from strange. There really not that exspensive. I really don't see a ranger 4cyl transfer case holding up to that much power. I know alot of guys build up there 4x4s and the transfer cases go out and then they just take the front driveline out and have a 2wd. I would do a V8 ranger if I was gonna do a 4x4 and use a real transfer case. I personally like the 205 or 204, and I would almost rob your whole drivetrain from a Bronco and use an adapter plate to go the the V8 bellhousing if your gonna do a turbo 4cyl. I think this would be a good time to do a 2.7 stroker or something. They have quite a few kits on raceeng.com. I really like the idea of using a 4bt turbo diesel too. you could get like 20plus miles a gallon and have tons of power, and low end torque. They use them in the delivery vans that deliver chips and generators.

[AJ_Fritz]

funny read i am just sitting back and watching on this one heheh.

[D94R]

I personally like the 205 or 204,

Blech. 1.9 crawl ratio is the sucketh! 300 would be better, but still not quite awesome at only 2.6:1.

[livetoride21]

sounds like a really cool build , you goin to put like 4.56 gears or 5:26?

then you could actually get some torque outa her

[jfive]

I don't like rock climbing though. I think its neat to look at a picture or two, but the chances of messing up months of work in a matter of seconds is just not my kind of fun. I like the 205 and 204 cause there are many of them, both chevy and ford used them for years. I like borg warner stuff, and they last a long time and don't have problems going into 4wd. I know that there are better ones out there but he was talking about building it more for looks, than for mudding or rock climbing. I personally think old willys jeeps and stuff had awesome rock crawling drivetrains. I used to live in idaho in the summer, and my ex stepdad had one and so did our neighbor and they have 4 shifters. You can gear it down a ton and they could climb the steppest mountain side at an idle almost. I really don't like bogging and rock climbing so I haven't done too much research on 4wd parts. I do like going through deep snow though. If all else fails have a winch or come along with you. Total confused, what heads are you gonna use on your 331. I am gonna build a 331 in about three years for a ranger, and I am gonna be using AFR heads, and dart block. Shooting for 900 to 1000hp and 2500 lbs or less.

[speedaddict]

Wont be any rockclimbing at all. Maybe a mudhole or two.

I'm going to pay a shop in Lakeland, Fla to install frontend and set-up my steering. After that T-case, Shafts, and tranny is up to me.

Still trying to decide on what case to use. I'm staying with the M50d(they're cheap and easy to get ahold of)

Aj, why sit-out on this one? :lol:

[smashed96gt]

If you're gonna do it get a doubler too.

[speedaddict]

Really dont have a need/space for a doubler. If it wasnt for that i prolly would.

My front shaft would be 3 times as long as the rear!!:lol:

[FordRacingZX3]

could always try to track down this guy

http://www.facebook.com/photo.php?pid=3427209&o=all&op=1&view=all&subj=22166130048&aid=-1&id=528040072#/photo.php?pid=31999394&o=all&op=1&view=all&subj=22166130048&aid=-1&id=39101326&fbid=507879992652

[speedaddict]

As a matter of fact i've seen that truck in action. I've been to the jesse black saloon truck pulls. Also i've seen his truck at the lakeland mudhole during competions(trucks gone wild)

thats where i used to live. I used to be big into the whole mud bogging scene. I tried to get out of it and try out racing.....Well the mud has kinda snuck back up and bit me and now i want to go do some serious bogging!!!

[jfive]

you need to come up north and try snow. It doesn't mess up your **** and its way more fun. Try going through 24 to 36 inches of snow in 4wheel peel. Its a blast. I thought muddin was cool, but I feel like I need to drop my IQ by 35 points to fit in.

[speedaddict]

Snow is way to cold bro.

We run around in bathing suits, drinking, and mud bogging.

Ya'll have alaskan fur jackets, will yellow slushy's, and ice everywhere. :hehe:

I chose number 1.

[93preranger]

Snow wheeling is awsome, but so is drinking beer an mud boging

speedaddict I think the 4x4 2.3t throwing roost from all 4 corners would be very cool. plus the look on everybody's face around the mud-hole when you say is just a 4banger. LOL

[speedaddict]

I know its gonna be awesome. Except its not gonna be a 2.3t. Its a 2.5T bored .030 over(i dont know what that makes)

Going to the u-pull it now. maybe i'll find some axles i like and a T-case.
I love u-pull-its. :lol:

[93preranger]

either way it sounds like a great project good luck

[speedaddict]

Thanks. Its expensive project

[speedaddict]

Ya'll thought it was never gonna happen....

Well it is, And i'm still gathering parts. I still haven't decided wether or not to run a ranger transfer case. I'm leaning towards a NP205, but going that route I may have to stretch the wheel base a few inches for my rear driveshaft to be longer than 8"

I'm open to suggestions. Talkin about 4wd on this forum is like going to a chevy forum and asking a ford questions. Gotta pull teeth to get answers.

[fordnut71]

Me personaly if I were to do a 4x4 turbo 2.3l I would use the bronco2 or the 1st gen explorer set up.I don't think a 1354 is really that bad your spliting the power load. 8.8 rear an dana 44 front. Just my 2 cents but I'm not really into the hevy off road scean

[speedaddict]

And its begun finally. Picked up the donor truck, bout a month or so ago. 86 K20 chevy 4x4. Drove it home 70mph down the highway and began tearing it apart. Paid $800 for the truck, guy needed money bad and i took advantage of him. 350, 4speed, with np208 case. Picked up tires for the chevy already, 16.00x20's(53" michelins) just waitin on my rockwells:D You'll have to wait for that one

anywho The rearend is a 14bolt 10.5" ring gear full floater. Front end is corp 10 bolt. With some good shafts the 10b will hold up just fine. Still gotta find a chevy side divorced 205. Ordered my gears, 5.38's. gonna play with some different tire sizes and see which one does the best. Lookin for something around 38"-40". May go with the military treads michelin xl or xml's. Bigger the better really buy dont wanna go to big and motor not be able to turn em.

It will be leaf sprung as im not needin alot of flex. mainly be muddy trails in south ga. all thats to do for the rear is weld new spring perches on hook up brakes and build shock brackets. Already have the front crossmember for the leafs built just got to finish tearing the front out and grinding. Oh btw, steering is Toyota ifs box, with ballistic fab crossover steering 7/8ths heims.

stay tuned next weekend will be pics of the front:cheers2:

[tcranger]

dam them tires look sweet i just now saw this thread it will be a fun project reminds me a lot of this video

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vLOIzUjiMh4

[Skyy_4life]

damn man, i remember when u weret alking about this 4wd thing, i thought u dropped it. good luck on the build bro, im sure this things gonna be a Beast in the end :)

[speedaddict]

Thanks ya'll, she'll be rollin around this comin weekend, gotta find a tcase and odd and end crap shock mounts, brake lines, driveshafts.

Just wish it was ext cab, thats the only downer.

[speedaddict]

And i love that build. that guys a goon, but the trucks badass. that video is kinda like inspiration :hehe:

[speedaddict]

Front end wont be in this weekend. Still waiting on parts. Had to order a fuel cell as well. With the truck being so short tcase will hit it, and can't slide it back any due to the 14bolt housing being so big. O well gotta improvise sometimes.

More pics to come...

[Skyy_4life]

any updateds bro? been waiting to see this build! i knew it was coming as soon as u decided to stick those tires and body lift on ur truck lol

[imaprobowler]

If you're going to go solid axle, I'd suggest going something bigger than a Dana 30 from a Jeep Cherokee (theres a reason its one of the first things we swap out when going with bigger tires or more power). Since you already have a Plan A of a D60, shoot for that.

Anything bigger than a 33 with lockers up front is asking for ring gear defilement. 42's??? LOL, on a D30? Good luck.

D30 = weak ujoints, weak hubs, weak axle shafts, weak ring gear/pinion gear, weak axle tubes. If you're serious about building a 4x4 Ranger then the D30 isn't a good choice. I'm surprised that TotallyConfused's V8 Ranger hasn't killed the D30. If you plan on just using this for wooded trails and fishing trips it will suffice, but anything serious like mud pits and rock climbing you'll soon put an end to its life.




The D44 rear is a good choice, but again 42's will be past its limit for serious hardcore wheeling. You're really looking for 1-ton axles with tires that big, and even then you're starting to push the limits of D60's unless you build the shat out of them. The 8.8 is mucho stronger than the D44, and could hold its own against the D60 in the rear, for a while, depending on setup and off roading.




Join Pirate4x4 and find out how to really build a proper setup.







Unless you're building this for looks and mud puddles.

I agree something bigger then a jeep dana 30 would be better. my bud is putting a Dana 70 in the rear and a Dana 60 front out of a 79 f150 or 250i can't remember, i just remember the guy we picked them up from SMELLED BAD. lol