Freebyrd Motor build!

[freebyrd24]

Figured I'd start a thread of my motor build, either for future use, or the many questions I'm sure I'll have!

I have my reman'd crank from rockauto.com and it came with main and rod bearings. After preparing everything and installing bearings and I set the crank in and it was hard to turn. I installed the caps and torqued them slightly and the crank wouldn't budge.

I took a look at the bearing package and they were .020" over. I figured that the crank had been ground since they supplied me with the crank and bearings together in a kit.

I went to the store after fiddling for a while and bought standard size bearings and now everything spins perfectly. What a pain though! I'll attach some pics later!

[bruiser]

good luck

[nagelandy55]

Make sure you use assembly lube, and don't be skimpy

[freebyrd24]

I was very liberal with my assembly lube! haha So far so good. Todays plan is to put the new rings on the pistons and install the pistons and rods. Any tips or tricks with ring installation?

[bruiser]

make sure you be very careful it is very easy to snap the top 2 rings
do you already have th pistons on the rods? if not i hope you know how to install them

[freebyrd24]

Yup pistons are on the rods already! And the top 2 rings no problem. The expander ring does not overlap correct? it has the two plastic pieces on top of each end to prevent overlapping correct?

[bruiser]

correctomundo!
after the pistons are in everything else is a breeze

[freebyrd24]

eeeexcellent. well rockauto also gave me oversized rod bearings which did not work, so i went and got standard sized bearings for the rods. Should I be able to turn the motor by hand with the pistons installed? By hand I mean putting a wrench on the crankpulley bolt and trying to turn the motor over

[freebyrd24]

On the rod bearings, there are notches on each side so you know how the bearings go in. When putting the caps on the crank journal, how do the bearing holes line up. By hole I mean the little indent in the cap side and the rod side. Do they go next to eachother? Or are they on opposite sides?

[freebyrd24]

I did some looking online, i guess there called tangs? not sure though if they should align

[Kurt]

The tangs only allow the bearings to go in one way and the caps should have been marked so you don't put them on the wrong direction.

[freebyrd24]

Upon closer inspection I see that the caps were marked from the factory. One side of the cap has a number, and one side of the rod has a number. I'm going to line them up with the numbers on the same side

[freebyrd24]

Progress from today ( In 92 degree temps in a garage )

Well yesterday I got the crank in, and had that discovery of bearings being incorrect.

I proceeded to get the piston rings installed, then installed the rods and pistons, oil pickup and pan. Flipped it over and got the headgasket and head on. All in all a pretty productive day (however aggravating it was)

I'll attach some pics! How can I add pics directly into my post instead of attaching them?

[taknotes]

go to photobucket.com upload..copy/paste the IMG tag

[Kurt]

how did you determine the bearings were std. and not .010? I have to say it seems really odd/rare that they would have given you the wrong bearings.

[freebyrd24]

I'm currently going back and forth with them regarding why they sent the wrong bearings. I installed the bearings and when the caps were just finger tight, the crankshaft was too tight to turn, wouldn't even budge. Same with the rod bearings. It is very odd/rare, I agree so I'll get to the bottom of it.

Any one have a good source or write up of installing the timing belt and lining up all the sprockets the correct way? My manual sucks for this, not a lot of detail. For the oil pump and the cam, I see there aretabs marked on the outside of the sprockets which I assume line up with the little arrow tabs on the plastic backing shroud. How does the crank line up? Does the little dot on the sprocket point straight up? I didn't find TDC when installing the head when I should have. Maybe I'll take it back off but hopefully theres an easier way to line it up

[bruiser]

this is what i found on timing if you still dont get it send me a pm and ill set you up

Make sure the crankshaft is at TDC on piston No. 1, with the crankshaft keyway pointing straight up and the circle on crankshaft sprocket aligned with notch in engine front cover (6019).

Align the timing marks.
Align the crankshaft sprocket mark to the front cover notch.
Align the oil pump sprocket diamond to the engine front cover diamond.
Align the camshaft sprocket triangle to the engine front cover triangle.

Install the timing chain/belt over the crankshaft sprocket (6306), proceeding counterclockwise over the oil pump sprocket and over the camshaft sprocket.

Loosen the bolt allowing the tensioner pulley to press against the timing chain/belt.

NOTE: The timing belt tensioner must not be tightened or belt tension will not be distributed over the entire belt.

Rotate the crankshaft two revolutions clockwise. Bring crank slowly to number one position firing position (keyway on crank facing up). The dot on the crankshaft gear is aligned with the notch on the front cover.
Recheck timing mark alignment. Repeat if required.
Tighten the bolts.

[freebyrd24]

Well I followed the instructions to a T and am having more problems. All the timing marks are dead on, and I can turn the crankshaft about 3/4 of a turn and then something hits. It sounds like maybe a valve touches the piston, but I'm not sure. When I first start turning it clockwise I have great suction on the number 1 cylinder and everything seems fine, and when I get about 3/4 of a turn around it just stops. Any ideas?

[Jesshwarren]

That is really strange. Did you turn the motor over with no head on it? How far did the pistons come up? These are a non interference motor so even if it is off timed the valves can never hit the pistons. You have a big problem I would take the motor apart and see what is going on.

You sure you got a 2.3L crank in there? I know a 2.5L crank would send the pistons into the head.

[freebyrd24]

Yea I was really sure that it was a non-interference motor so I was really baffled as well. I thought that the height of the pistons looked good before i put the head on. I'll have to take the head off and take a look then. I just don't understand why it only does it exactly 3/4 of a turn of the crankshaft. If the crank was a 2.5 I think it would have hit earlier than that if it really is the valves that are hitting the pistons. I don't know, what a dumb problem, I'll check back when I take the head off and check. Problem after problem...................

And I did order a 2.3L crank, but with all the problems I'm having who the heck knows.:frown: :banghead: :banghead: :banghead: :banghead:

[bruiser]

wow that sucks i gotta pick up my head bolts and then ill beable to check mine as well i hop i dont run into this sorry to hear that...man this forum has been dead the past couple of days...where is everyone?

[Jesshwarren]

If it is a 2.5L crank the SVO guys pay $$ for the 2.5L crank ;) With the head off take a few pics of the pistons when they are up all the way. They should come up even with the deck of the block.

Jess

[freebyrd24]

It really has been dead lately, which is a shame I always check the board and love this board!

Well time for good news bad news.....

Good news is that the pistons are NOT making contact with the head. Bad news, somehow the crank and piston assembly will spin 3/4 and then just stop. This happens right after pistons number 2 and 3 are on there way back down. It just STOPS. Which is extremely weird. I'm going to have to take the pan off and check it out. I swear I spun the assembly around a few cranks after I initially put them in to make sure they spun. I mean is this a bearing somewhere? Hopefully I can find something obvious when I get in there, but Jeez these problems dont want to friggen stop!

[Jesshwarren]

I can't think of what it could hit??

[Footballer30]

if i were you i would be on the safe side and go buy some plastigauge and check the crank and the rod bearing just to check your clearances and make sure all your rods are in the right direction and your wrist pins are floating good and your crank to piston clearance.

[Kurt]

if i were you i would be on the safe side and go buy some plastigauge and check the crank and the rod bearing just to check your clearances and make sure all your rods are in the right direction and your wrist pins are floating good and your crank to piston clearance.

I agree. You said the bearing it came with were too small, so you went out and purchased std. size bearings. How do you know you don't need .010 under bearings? If the crank was ground .01 under, it won't spin with .02 under bearings but it will spin with .010 or std..... but std. size bearing will be too loose (obviously). This may having nothing to do with your current problem, but is definitely a big red flag.

[freebyrd24]

Absolutely, I'm going to have to check all this out now. I wish they had just sent the correct bearings like they were supposed to. This is rediculous. I mean that may also be a problem having std bearings, but since std would make it looser if nothing else, then it shouldn't bind up. IDK ill see what comes up when I take off the oil pan

[bruiser]

i wish i could get a hold of someone than wants to but my 2.5l crank no one around here wants it
but good luck with finding out whats wrong with it

[freebyrd24]

GREAT news people. It was my fault. Hahaha I'll attach some pictures, hopefully they can illustrate what I explain. As you can see in previous pics, I installed my oil drain line into my oil pan. The fitting extends maybe almost 2 inches inward towards the crank and rods. This stupid fitting lines up perfectly with the rods and the rod hits the fitting on the way by. Now instead of plugging the hole in the pan, I'm going to just try to cut off the over excessive length of the shaft

I have no idea how this didn't hit the rods before when I was up and running. Onwards we go! haha

[nagelandy55]

phew at least it wasn't the bearings or something more expensive

[bruiser]

congrats...now get a shorter plug..lol

[freebyrd24]

Hahaha I was able to shorten it very easily and assembled it back together with plenty of clearance. She spins freely and is lookin good! The motors competely back assembled and ready to head back into the truck the way I took it out with the water pump, alt and bracket on, upper and lower intake on, all set READY TO GO! haha I can't wait to get it in, hopefully this weekend

[bruiser]

sweet deal...im deff gonna be next..heading up to the auto store to buy new header bolts and a key way that i missed placed somewhere
also do you have pic or something of your keyway?
i dont remember what it looks like was it moon shape or flat?

[freebyrd24]

Damn I torqued down my crankshaft bolt today over the keyway so Idk if I can get you a pic, the it is moon shaped, thats probably the best way to describe it. Flat on one side, sort of moon shaped on the other, maybe 2-2.5 inches long. Thanks everyone!

[bruiser]

sweet thanks alot

[freebyrd24]

So I have been hard at work the last couple of days. I have the motor installed, and everything all set. I started it up and its smoking at a decent rate. Lots of white smoke. I think there was a good amount of residual oil left in the header and turbo from when the motor blew up the first time. How long does it take oil to burn off? Theres a decent amount im pretty sure. I also seem to have a leak between the turbo and the manifold, so I'll replace the gasket in the next couple of days. My idle is alittle erradic too, I'm going to have to do some investigating...

[Jesshwarren]

I hope the smoke clears up ok. Keep us posted.

[freebyrd24]

Definately, I'm reeeeally hoping that it will! When I do that gasket I can see if theres more oil in there

[freebyrd24]

So I started it today, after i backed out the idle adjustment screw on the throttle body and it idled perfectly! Also, while I was expecting more smoke, the smoke appears to have completely dissipated! I have a slight leak on the turbo-manifold gasket still, but it is very minimal, and i will do that shortly, but there is no smoke at all coming from the tailpipe! I also thought I heard a ticking noise, and it turned out to be two spark plugs arcing out on eachother/the heat wrap I had put on there. So everytihng is good so far, and after I replace that gasket, I will take it out for a drive and see how it goes!

[bruiser]

thats awesome man hope all goes good dont forget your break in miles before you go to wild....lol i cant wait

[freebyrd24]

Oh I know, these break in miles are going to be torture!

[nagelandy55]

Brake the engine in hard, don't idle around.

[Kurt]

Brake the engine in hard, don't idle around.

X2 :peelout:

[bruiser]

what do ya'll mean break it in hard i heard your not supoused to drive it hard until after 500 miles

[Kurt]

I guess I should refine my statement a little more. IMO!!!!!.... don't beat the living hell out of it, but definitely don't go easy on it either. Perhaps, moderate aggression is a better way to put it :)

[nagelandy55]

haha ya don't bounch it off the rev limiter but don't just putt around either.

[Jesshwarren]

Go up and down with the RPM's a good bit.

[freebyrd24]

Gotcha, thats what I thought you were supposed to do. So far its just seen maybe 30 mins of idle. Once I do that turbo gasket I'll start driving around. I'm just nervous about driving around and getting stuck. Ya never know what can happen on a fresh motor! I think I should have some time to do the gasket wednesday so I'll keep everyone posted! thanks everyone!

[freebyrd24]

Well I have two things going on right now

First of all, my oil sensor gauge is flickering like crazy. Soemtimes it stays fine in the center, then it flutters off and on quickly, then sometimes its down all the way. When I'm driving the gauge will come on and off with the touch of the gas pedal, at any rpm, usually stays up more often with higher rpms

At about 2500-3000 rpms, at light throttle, it sounds like its knocking too. But if I give it a little more gas, the knocking noise goes away, and so far its only around those RPMS, and its sounds like its coming from the motor

Any ideas people? Did the oil pump crap the bed out of no where? This truck is sucking my money and patience dry

[nagelandy55]

Wouldn't hurt to check the oil pressure with a real guage, could be that your oil pump is worn out. The knocking could be from low oil pressure.

[freebyrd24]

I have an aftermarket one, but the sender unit has never worked properly. I ordered one yesterday though so I won't run it again until it comes in. If the oil pump is toast, I'm assuming I'll have to take the whole motor out again? How do I do the oil pump?

[freebyrd24]

So 12 psi at idle. That a little low i assume? I don't even wanna drive it again to find out. It acts normal at start up, and when I start driving, after a minute is when the gauge would start flickering and cause problems. Whats the verdict? Oil pump toast?

[Jesshwarren]

So 12 psi at idle. That a little low i assume? I don't even wanna drive it again to find out. It acts normal at start up, and when I start driving, after a minute is when the gauge would start flickering and cause problems. Whats the verdict? Oil pump toast?

:conf45: I will say I hope it is the oil pump but most likely not. Oil pressure is made of resistance from tight tolerances, A new motor will run high oil psi new bearings crank tight tolerances takes more PSI to push the oil threw. A motor that the bearings are gone in, or worn real bad will run low oil PSI because the oil is just running out threw the looser bearings.

I am wondering with your crank and the bearings you ordered where they for sure matched ok. You running std bearings on a stock crank right?

I would pull the motor, replace the oil pump check the crank and bearings. If the bearings are bad they will all need replaced. With the knock you described it sounds like a bearing problem.

[freebyrd24]

Thats what I am fearing! Yeah I am running the standard bearings on a stock crank. I'm really unsure, but I am going to try the oil pump first since I can do it with the motor installed. I'll know pretty soon after that if its a bearing problem. Theres nothing I'd rather not do then pull the damn motor again, but we will see what happens!

[bruiser]

well if you do pull it again atleast you know what you need to do and how to do it...but it still sucks

[Kurt]

Thats what I am fearing! Yeah I am running the standard bearings on a stock crank. I'm really unsure, but I am going to try the oil pump first since I can do it with the motor installed. I'll know pretty soon after that if its a bearing problem. Theres nothing I'd rather not do then pull the damn motor again, but we will see what happens!

So you did or did not use the crank from rockauto?

[freebyrd24]

Yeah I ended up using that crank. It probably is a bearing problem that I failed to address. I'll know what to look for this time. This was my first engine rebuild attempt

[Kurt]

Yeah I ended up using that crank. It probably is a bearing problem that I failed to address. I'll know what to look for this time. This was my first engine rebuild attempt

That's why I kept asking you why you purchased stardard bearings to be used on a ground remaufactured crank!

[Jesshwarren]

Make sure the bearings and the crank are matched. Don't let this get you down. It's not a real big job to fix.

[freebyrd24]

It's very very disappointing. Now I have to take everything back apart again. Which is a crappy job to attempt with my limited help and time. You were right kurt, i just wish I had realized before how extremely important those clearances were. This bloooooooooows

Where do you order specific bearings with the proper clearances? My local parts store didn't have anything inbetween the size that was too tight and standard.

[Jesshwarren]

What is your stock crank like? Does it have any scores in it?

[freebyrd24]

The 2.5 crank? It looks perfect! I was surprised just how clean and smooth it was, hardly looked worn!

Well after posting about this a few hours ago, I had a buddy over and we went outside and nearly got the motor out. Just have to do the bell housing bolts and its out! I got a little burst of motivation from the forum and went to town on it! I'm pretty glad I did, I took a big dent out of the work I would have had to do tomorrow in the hot sun! Its been 95+ degrees the last few days here.

I'll post more when I inspect the bearings and I'll be very thorough about it!

Thanks everyone!

Oh we should have some kind of poll of how many people have the motors in there truck VS out of it!

Freebyrd motor build part 2!

[loridnranger]

what is svo

[nagelandy55]

what is svo


Oh dear :frown: you should look into that.

[Jesshwarren]

what is svo

SVO mustang. There was a SVO mustang with the 2.3L turbo motor made back in the 80's

[freebyrd24]

Where does everyone get their aftermarket oversized bearings?

[salating]

you can goto the parts store and order them

[Jesshwarren]

How much was the crank turned down?

[freebyrd24]

Well I have the official numbers here, I need help picking the correct bearings. Using the blue plastigauge, with standard sized bearings, I have a clearance of .009 inches on both the rod bearings and the crankshaft. Any ideas?

Is it just as simple as adding to get to the recommended specs? Like take .009 and add the bearing number needed to get the desired clearance?

[salating]

i would get bearings that are .010

i would take it to a machine shop and have them fit up the bearings to be sure

they may need to take .001 off the crank in order for the .010 bearings to work properly
otherwise it will be to tight and you will waste them all pretty quick

stock ones are out of the question unless you get another crank

[freebyrd24]

Is this .010 for both the crank and rods? So you think they may be out of spec if the crank isn't turned down anymore?

[salating]

Did you measure the where the rods go on the crank or where the main bearings are at on the crank?

If the crank had a spun rod bearing and it scratched the crank up they may have just turned the ones for the rods and not the mains.

But i dont see why they would turn it to .009 and not .010.

[freebyrd24]

I measured both the crankshaft mains, and where the rods attach to the crank. Both has the same .009 clearance. The plastigauge was about right on for the rods, and it was almost perfect for the mains. It may actually be .010 on the mains, the size is soooo close, the highest plastigauge set I have goes up to .009

[salating]

they may already be at .010

go get your self some .010 rod and main bearings and put it back together

[freebyrd24]

Will do! I found the rod bearings, now I am waiting for the mains to arrive. They werent in stock unfortunantly~! Thanks a lot for the sizing tips salating!

[freebyrd24]

UPDATE!

Thursday night after I got home, I got the bearings installed and had the motor all back together.

Friday I got home around noon, and had the engine in and running by 5pm. It went great. I put about 70 miles on it today, some good break-in miles and the trucks running awesome! I'm very pleased and I have 50+ pounds of oil pressure!

Only thing now is just some minor tuning. Sometimes at a stop light, the truck won't idle and wants to shut off, but sometimes it will idle no problem. Just a little strange

[bruiser]

awesome man glad to hear you have it all straightened out ill be next lol

[Jesshwarren]

Got to say you are quick :) I'm impressed

[freebyrd24]

Whaaaaaat a day I had. I was on a roll gettin that thing back together. I had the truck parked out front of my neighbors house at 530 and he had seen me puttin the motor together in my garage thursday night. He came over and asked if I was done and I said yee. He said "bull****, pop the hood"
hahaha he was shocked